Going up with the .284 Win.

[RangerRiz]

I was just wondering if anyone out there has or is using a wildcat of say .308,8mm..338,or.358-.284.
     I have a winchester 88 in 308 and wanted a little more power. Ihave also given consideration to .358 win. Have dies and dont have to change the mag.


                                                                   Thanks,
                                                                       Justin

[rockrat]

Only gone up with a 44/284 in an xp-100 and built a rifle on it also.  Rifle pushed a 265gr bullet near to 2600 fps with a 23" bbl.

[elk_chaser1]

I have been shooting a .308-284 for several years.  Have had good success with it on Elk with 165 gr and 180 gr bullets.  When loaded to moderate levels, it behaves much like a 30.06.

[alsredoak]

I built a 338/284 on a Mod 48 mauser a few years ago.Works and shoots fine. Knocks bear for a loop.Built it as a bear and moose gun for here in NH. Alsredoak

[iiranger]

was that the .284 has the capacity of the .30/'06 in a shorter case...!!! So by giving up one in the magazine, you can have an "'06???" in a short action.

O.K. the short powder column and sharp shoulder have proved themselves. My gunsmith buddy was nuts over the 6mm/.284... But for your purposes, just look for the "'06" equivelent and you will be awful close. .35 Wheland. .333 OKH or that new thing. .270...Close. Luck. Happy trails.

[Lone Star]

Since the OP has a Win Model 88 he can't use an '06-based case.  The .284 has slightly less capacity than the '06 case when filled to the neck, with heavy bullets seated it has quite a bit less capacity.  The 6.5/.284 is probably the most popular wildcat on this case today, but it is not really suited for the M88.

You will not notice any difference in the field between a .358/.284 and a .358 WCF.  Just like not seeing a difference between the .308 and the .30-06.  100-150 fps is just not enough difference to matter.  Go with the .358 WCF.


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[Siskiyou]

I have thought about going to the .30-284 in a Remington 722 action.  I also discard the idea because the gain for me does not justify the cost.  Many argue that the .284 case has the same powder capacity as the -06 case.  That is a yes and no result.  The problem being the short neck on the .284 Winchester case results in heavier bullets intruding on the powder space. 

Now days there may be a way of mitigating reduced powder space. I have read J.J. reports on the 165-Barnes bullet.  Without having a pile of bullets in front of me to measure overall length admittedly I am shooting from the hip.  My assumption is a 150 or 165-grain bullet from Barnes is shorter then bonded, and lead core bullets from other makers.  Rather than using a 180-grain from the other guy the user of a 150 or 165-grain bullet in theory will obtain the same or better results.  A couple other options when they become available are the new lead free bullets from Hornady and Nosler.  Will the new bullets match or exceed the results J.J. obtained from the Barnes bullet?  Only time will tell.

Even in good times the availability of .284 cases is questionable.  A wildcatter brother currently has two rifles that use the .284 Winchester as a parent case.  One is a 6.5-284 and the other is a .25-284.  For some reason I keep thinking he might have a 6mm-284.  I know that he has paid a premium price for cases at times. 

If the Model 88, 308 Winchester barrel is rechamber the user is looking at a 22-inch barrel.  It gets difficult to compare velocities between the .308 and the 30-06 because most 308 reading are taken from a .22-inch barrel and the 30-06 from a 23 or 24-inch barrel.  The value of two more inches cannot be over emphasized.

Apples and Oranges, I think not.  The gain in powder capacity between the 308 Winchester Case and the 30-284 case when loading bullets 180-grains, or heavier maybe insignificant.   

My old friend, hunting, and fishing partner has passed on, but he had an early Winchester M88 in .308 Winchester.  He killed many a buck using 180-grain WW Silvertips.  If he was around today I would try and convince him to try the Hornaday 165-grain light magnum load.  If he did not want to pay the price the 165-grain standard Hornady load is a good option.  A friend who started out with a 30-06 has hunted almost exclusively with a 308 Winchester, loaded with the 165-grain Hornady bullet.  He consistently takes two or more bucks a year.  It is hard to argue with success. 

**After letting this set to eat dinner I came back to it with a couple of thoughts.  Winchester modified the magazine of the model 88 to feed the fat .284 case.  The 308 and the 243 used the same magazine.

If you re-chambered for the .358 Winchester you need a different magazine.

A friend during my youth had one in 284 Winchester and he was always trying convince me that it was better than then my .270.  In our area boys only discussed two subjects’ deer rifles, and girls.

[RaySendero]

Well...Ok, I'll throw out one possibility:

How about a 9,3/284!

& load it with a 250 Swift "A"!!!
(Shouldn't be too intrusive into case capacity)

[dpe.ahoy]

The 358 Win is the 308 case necked up, wouldn't need a different magazine for that cartridge.  It's not a wildcat, but as hard as it was to find cases for it it could be classed as one.   Finally found some at Midway and they just got here last night, time to get some loaded up for my new BLR.  DP

[Lone Star]

The value of two more inches cannot be over emphasized.

Actually, it can be.  For actual test data taken from the same barrels cut down and chronographed at different lengths:

G&A, July 1989
.308/165-gr FL
22" - 2674 fps
21" - 2636
20" - 2617
19" - 2595
Total loss for 3" lost = 79 fps, or 26 fps/inch

G&A, November 1981
.30-06 165-gr FL
26" - 2896 fps
24" - 2850
22" - 2820
20" - 2772
Total loss for 6" lost = 124 fps, or 21 fps/inch

G&A, September 1987
.308 180-gr, 44.5/IMR4320
24" - 2700 fps
22" - 2650
20" - 2625
Total loss for 4" lost = 75 fps, or 19 fps/inch

Clearly - old wives' tales aside - actual test data proves that losing 2" of barrel length with cartridges like the .308 and .30-06 makes no practical difference in the field.  This squares with what Remington has published for many years, that around 25 fps/inch is the expected velocity loss for cartridges with similar muzzle velocities.


Bottom line - don't sweat the small stuff. 


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[jsh]

30-284= 7.5x55 Swiss. I have a few K31 rifles and have considered this caliber on several different platforms to build on. The rim is pretty much the only difference, as I use a set of 30-284 dies to load my k31's with. Some said it wouldn't work.......................
I have two 308's one is a 15" encore, the other a model Win.100. I have seen neither of these suffer from any type of power issues. Killed deer with both, funny thing is I had longer shoots come up when packing the pistol. I went to 150 grain bullets in the pistol and stuck with 165's in the rifle.

I think you may see some gain going to the 30-284 with 165's and up.  A rechamber to the 30-284 would clean up throat and chamber of the 308 very nice. 35-284 would be a nice one and and a good selection of bullets for varmints to moose.
I did a bit of reading a while back on 375-284. Ballistics were pretty impressive for such a short case. Had really considered this one, as the 375's I have fooled with were all exceptionally good shooters with cast and jacketed.
I myself would go to a bolt gun for any of the above mentioned calibers to get full benefit from a bit of custom work.
jeff