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Offline FWiedner

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« Reply #30 on: June 21, 2006, 06:47:03 AM »
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If the Republicans can find someone that fits the bill, I will vote for them.



Made that mistake in 2000.

Turned out to be a liar and a puppet.

Never again.

NEVER AGAIN.

 :evil:
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #31 on: June 21, 2006, 07:25:18 AM »
So you're attorneys, that means you're part of the problem, not part of the solution. You have been so thoroughly brainwashed by your law school experience that you can't even tell what's going on around you. I don't need to read SC decisions, all I need to read is the Constitution, a fringe publication written by wild-eyed fanatics. By making the statement that the SC opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, you have proved my point. Knowledge is certainly lacking, and it is clearly not on the part of us who can see what's happening to the country.

Stating that Bush "gave" some of your money back and you are now "allowed" to purchase an "assault weapon" is ludicrous. First of all, the gov shouldn't be stealing your money at the point of a gun in the first place. Are you now advocating armed robbery? It would seem that as long as it's someone with a gun you approve of, you are fine with it. Forcing me to give money to a cause I don't believe in is tyranny my friend. As for the so-called "assault weapon", it is obvious from your post you don't know much about this subject at all. First of all, you cannot buy a selective fire weapon in most States and haven't been able to since 1934. Second, if you happen to live in a State that "allows" you to exercise this right, you must pay $300.00(non-refundable, of course) to the BATFE and allow them to do a full investigation into your life. Secondly, Bush clearly stated, on several occasions, that he would sign a new semi - auto ban if Congress delivered one to his desk, so who you crappin?

Again, repeating the same action over and over again (voting for repugs and demons) and expecting a different result (that they will magically change and restore to us a Constitutional Republic) is the very definition of insanity. Today all of those idiots claim a mandate from the people if they are elected. Let's look at that. On average, we get 40 - 50% voter turn out at any given election. A politician wins by getting, at most, 50 -60% of this vote. So, these slim balls are claiming a mandate from the people when they only got 20 - 30% of the people to agree with them! Hardly a mandate by any definition. What if we only had a 5 - 10% turn out? I think that would send a loud message to them that we are not happy and demand a change. The only reason third party candidates do so poorly is because people like you refuse to give them a chance.

Offline victorcharlie

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« Reply #32 on: June 21, 2006, 08:22:06 AM »
Yep.......
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. Tolerance in the face of tyranny is no virtue."
Barry Goldwater

Offline CyberSniper

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« Reply #33 on: June 21, 2006, 08:24:56 AM »
You all can debate and argue this from now until doomsday.
But, the reality of the situation is that the voters will
not go third party in nearly enough numbers to break the system
as we know it right now. ( Various reasons why don't matter, they just won't. )

Therefore, this entire debate has no basis in reality, and is
nothing more than an interesting intellectual exercise.

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2006, 09:51:42 AM »
I don't think for a minute that I am going to change anyone's mind, after all you can lead a man to knowledge but you can't make him think. Slowly though, the tide is turning. More and more people are refusing to vote for the so-called "lesser of two evils." More and more people are not voting at all, except, like me, to oppose any tax increases. It is going to take time, most likely more than we have, but people are starting to wake up.

Offline FWiedner

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« Reply #35 on: June 21, 2006, 09:53:01 AM »
Quote from: CyberSniper
You all can debate and argue this from now until doomsday.
But, the reality of the situation is that the voters will
not go third party in nearly enough numbers to break the system
as we know it right now. ( Various reasons why don't matter, they just won't. )

Therefore, this entire debate has no basis in reality, and is
nothing more than an interesting intellectual exercise.



Translation...

There's nothing you can do to stop it, so you might as well just lay back and enjoy it.

The American spirit on display is a thing to behold, ain't it?

 :shock:
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline CyberSniper

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« Reply #36 on: June 21, 2006, 09:56:49 AM »
Bush Master:
Agreed on that.
And I hate to say it, but you are also probably right about not
having enough time.

FWiedner: That's not what I'm saying.
I'm saying I have a feeling of impending doom, because I just
don't see enough people changing the way they do things
anytime soon.

Offline CyberSniper

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« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2006, 10:03:12 AM »
I hope you're right.

Offline FWiedner

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« Reply #38 on: June 21, 2006, 10:04:22 AM »
I wasn't really trying to imply that as your personal attitude, it just struck me that people aren't trying to change anything because they either don't think that it matters, or they don't think that they can, or maybe they just don't know how.

Inaction has become a way of life.

If some heinous crime or injustice is committted by government, Americans are no longer able to express outrage to the point of forcing accountability or change.

Citizenship is now a spectator sport.

 :?
They may talk of a "New Order" in the  world, but what they have in mind is only a revival of the oldest and worst tyranny.   No liberty, no religion, no hope.   It is an unholy alliance of power and pelf to dominate and to enslave the human race.

Offline CyberSniper

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« Reply #39 on: June 21, 2006, 10:05:24 AM »
Agreed again.

Offline Casull

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« Reply #40 on: June 21, 2006, 01:13:58 PM »
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So you're attorneys, that means you're part of the problem, not part of the solution. You have been so thoroughly brainwashed by your law school experience that you can't even tell what's going on around you. I don't need to read SC decisions, all I need to read is the Constitution, a fringe publication written by wild-eyed fanatics. By making the statement that the SC opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, you have proved my point. Knowledge is certainly lacking, and it is clearly not on the part of us who can see what's happening to the country.


I love it when some arrogant know it all shows his lack of a thought process.  OOOOOOH, you're an attorney and therefore part of the problem.  What does that even mean?  Also, you claim to not need to read SC decisions, because you have read the Constitution.  As the interpreter of last resort of the Constitution, the SC and its opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, whether you like it or not.  Are there opinions that I find nonsensical?  Of course, but given time the bad ones are usually reversed.  Even though appointed for life, and suposedly not subject to political pressure, we all know that justices are affected by societal trends and not dispassionate interpretors of the law.

Quote
Stating that Bush "gave" some of your money back and you are now "allowed" to purchase an "assault weapon" is ludicrous. First of all, the gov shouldn't be stealing your money at the point of a gun in the first place. Are you now advocating armed robbery? It would seem that as long as it's someone with a gun you approve of, you are fine with it. Forcing me to give money to a cause I don't believe in is tyranny my friend. As for the so-called "assault weapon", it is obvious from your post you don't know much about this subject at all.


What's ludicrous is your belief that not voting, or voting for a third party candidate, will somehow stop the government from stealing my money at the point of a gun.  The Constitution allows the government to levy taxes, and our elected officials have legislated just that thing.  Do I like this?  No, but it is not robbery.  If enough people would vote out all those a**holes that keep raising taxes, we could solve that problem.  As to my remark about "assault weapons", I can assure that I do know a little about the subject.  However, in your zealous attempt to show off your intellect, you missed the fact that I placed that term in quotes.  Of course I could have said "semi-automatic weapons arbitrarily identified as assault weapons based solely upon their appearance", but I assumed that you would understand my clear meaning.  I guess not.  In any event, by voting for Bush, I did and do receive a little more of my money back at tax time (which I can assure you would not be the case if Kerry were president), and I can purchase a semi-automatic weapon arbitrarily identified as an assault weapon based solely on appearance.

Quote
What if we only had a 5 - 10% turn out? I think that would send a loud message to them that we are not happy and demand a change. The only reason third party candidates do so poorly is because people like you refuse to give them a chance.


So, let me get this right.  The politicians are willing to take the vote of a minority of the voting age public as a mandate, but if that minority is even smaller, then they will get the message and come around to your way of thinking.  As to third party candidates, the reason they do so poorly is because there are so few people who think as you do.

Again, I am certainly not happy with everything Bush has done.  But I also don't consider him the lesser of two evils.  I would say that half of loaf is better than none.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline Casull

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« Reply #41 on: June 21, 2006, 01:16:12 PM »
Quote
So you're attorneys, that means you're part of the problem, not part of the solution. You have been so thoroughly brainwashed by your law school experience that you can't even tell what's going on around you. I don't need to read SC decisions, all I need to read is the Constitution, a fringe publication written by wild-eyed fanatics. By making the statement that the SC opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, you have proved my point. Knowledge is certainly lacking, and it is clearly not on the part of us who can see what's happening to the country.


I love it when some arrogant know it all shows his lack of a thought process.  OOOOOOH, you're an attorney and therefore part of the problem.  What does that even mean?  Also, you claim to not need to read SC decisions, because you have read the Constitution.  As the interpreter of last resort of the Constitution, the SC and its opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, whether you like it or not.  Are there opinions that I find nonsensical?  Of course, but given time the bad ones are usually reversed.  Even though appointed for life, and suposedly not subject to political pressure, we all know that justices are affected by societal trends and not dispassionate interpretors of the law.

Quote
Stating that Bush "gave" some of your money back and you are now "allowed" to purchase an "assault weapon" is ludicrous. First of all, the gov shouldn't be stealing your money at the point of a gun in the first place. Are you now advocating armed robbery? It would seem that as long as it's someone with a gun you approve of, you are fine with it. Forcing me to give money to a cause I don't believe in is tyranny my friend. As for the so-called "assault weapon", it is obvious from your post you don't know much about this subject at all.


What's ludicrous is your belief that not voting, or voting for a third party candidate, will somehow stop the government from stealing my money at the point of a gun.  The Constitution allows the government to levy taxes, and our elected officials have legislated just that thing.  Do I like this?  No, but it is not robbery.  If enough people would vote out all those a**holes that keep raising taxes, we could solve that problem.  As to my remark about "assault weapons", I can assure that I do know a little about the subject.  However, in your zealous attempt to show off your intellect, you missed the fact that I placed that term in quotes.  Of course I could have said "semi-automatic weapons arbitrarily identified as assault weapons based solely upon their appearance", but I assumed that you would understand my clear meaning.  I guess not.  In any event, by voting for Bush, I did and do receive a little more of my money back at tax time (which I can assure you would not be the case if Kerry were president), and I can purchase a semi-automatic weapon arbitrarily identified as an assault weapon based solely on appearance.

Quote
What if we only had a 5 - 10% turn out? I think that would send a loud message to them that we are not happy and demand a change. The only reason third party candidates do so poorly is because people like you refuse to give them a chance.


So, let me get this right.  The politicians are willing to take the vote of a minority of the voting age public as a mandate, but if that minority is even smaller, then they will get the message and come around to your way of thinking.  As to third party candidates, the reason they do so poorly is because there are so few people who think as you do.

Again, I am certainly not happy with everything Bush has done.  But I also don't consider him the lesser of two evils.  I would say that half of loaf is better than none.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline victorcharlie

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« Reply #42 on: June 21, 2006, 02:40:42 PM »
Casull......

Quote
If enough people would vote out all those a**holes that keep raising taxes, we could solve that problem.


That's just exactly what I'm trying to do.......glad you agree......

Now it's just a matter of figureing out how to do it........

I think the time may very well be right for a third party push......

Bill Clinton had a few good points as well.....welfare reform for one.....he also had $8 dollar a barrel oil....and no one would argue that the ninties were one of the most profitable periods in history........

Did Bill Clinton's few good points out weigh his bad points?

You can find a silver lining in any cloud if you look hard enough.......

I'm so outraged at the republicans.......We gave them power and what have we got?  

No.....not again.......I'm going libertarian......if the Dems get in because of it then maybe the republicans will learn who they work for......they deserve to be sent home........the sad fact is that in order to send the message, other scoundrels are sure to take there place.....

But it won't be because I didn't try.............
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. Tolerance in the face of tyranny is no virtue."
Barry Goldwater

Offline nabob

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« Reply #43 on: June 21, 2006, 03:25:45 PM »
Wow. Too much stress. This will help relax everyone:

Now, follow with me - clear your minds of any bad karmic thoughts, inhale pink, exhale blue. When exhaling, focus on the fifth chakra and make the sound of the chakra, which corresponds to a "G".

Or you can just use the westernized version of this, which is to inhale deeply then exhale, chanting "out with the bad &&&&, in with the good &&&&"

Either way will bring us all to oneness with each other and the universe.

 

 :lol:

Offline Casull

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« Reply #44 on: June 21, 2006, 06:29:11 PM »
I don't go in for that eastern mysticism, but in this instance I say Amen Nabob.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline dukkillr

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« Reply #45 on: June 21, 2006, 07:27:25 PM »
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I love it when some arrogant know it all shows his lack of a thought process. OOOOOOH, you're an attorney and therefore part of the problem. What does that even mean? Also, you claim to not need to read SC decisions, because you have read the Constitution.


I considered asking him to explain article 3 sections 1&2 but I decided it wouldn't help any.  Like he says, you can't make someone think.

Offline WylieKy

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« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2006, 02:25:01 AM »
Quote from: nabob

Now, follow with me - clear your minds of any bad karmic thoughts, inhale pink, exhale blue. When exhaling, focus on the fifth chakra and make the sound of the chakra, which corresponds to a "G".


 :lol:


It's not working for me.  Is it a "hard G" or a "soft G" sound?

 :grin:

WylieKy
This that I do, I do by my own free will.

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2006, 05:02:13 AM »
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I love it when some arrogant know it all shows his lack of a thought process.  OOOOOOH, you're an attorney and therefore part of the problem.  What does that even mean?  Also, you claim to not need to read SC decisions, because you have read the Constitution.  As the interpreter of last resort of the Constitution, the SC and its opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, whether you like it or not.  Are there opinions that I find nonsensical?  Of course, but given time the bad ones are usually reversed.  Even though appointed for life, and supposedly not subject to political pressure, we all know that justices are affected by societal trends and not dispassionate interpretors of the law.


I guess when I make present a case you cannot refute, I become arrogant. However, it is you, typical of an attorney, who is arrogant and unable to form a reasoned argument. I would imagine your "practice" isn't doing too well. If you don't know what that means then you are more clueless than I thought. Here's what Thomas Jefferson had to say about your so-called facts:

To consider the judges as the ultimate arbiters of all constitutional questions [is] a very dangerous doctrine indeed, and one which would place us under the despotism of an oligarchy. Our judges are as honest as other men and not more so. They have with others the same passions for party, for power, and the privilege of their corps. Their maxim is boni judicis est ampliare jurisdictionem [good justice is broad jurisdiction], and their power the more dangerous as they are in office for life and not responsible, as the other functionaries are, to the elective control. The Constitution has erected no such single tribunal, knowing that to whatever hands confided, with the corruptions of time and party, its members would become despots. It has more wisely made all the departments co-equal and co-sovereign within themselves." --Thomas Jefferson to William C. Jarvis, 1820. ME 15:277

It is this and many, many more facts the founders wrote and said about the Constitution prove you are completely wrong. I could bury you in them, but what's the point? Looks like you threw away good money obtaining that law degree. Where you get the wild idea that the bad ones are usually reversed is beyond me. I am sure some of them have been, but most are not. Plus, they keep making more and more bad ones!

Quote
What's ludicrous is your belief that not voting, or voting for a third party candidate, will somehow stop the government from stealing my money at the point of a gun.  The Constitution allows the government to levy taxes, and our elected officials have legislated just that thing.  Do I like this?  No, but it is not robbery.  If enough people would vote out all those a**holes that keep raising taxes, we could solve that problem.  As to my remark about "assault weapons", I can assure that I do know a little about the subject.  However, in your zealous attempt to show off your intellect, you missed the fact that I placed that term in quotes.  Of course I could have said "semi-automatic weapons arbitrarily identified as assault weapons based solely upon their appearance", but I assumed that you would understand my clear meaning.  I guess not.  In any event, by voting for Bush, I did and do receive a little more of my money back at tax time (which I can assure you would not be the case if Kerry were president), and I can purchase a semi-automatic weapon arbitrarily identified as an assault weapon based solely on appearance.

The Constitution does not give Congress the right to levy an income tax, sorry. If that were true, why did they feel the need for the 16th Amendment? At least in those days they at least pretended to follow the Constitution. Again sorry, but taxing me to pay for your pet cause is ARMED ROBBERY, whether you want to admit it or not. Then you reverse yourself in the next sentence and appear to agree with me! Do you really believe that things would be very much different if Kerry had won? Now that's funny! In the 2000 election, Bush II ran on a platform of a smaller and less intrusive government, then grew government more than any President in history! As to the intrusive part, I think the Patriot Act, John Ashcroft and Alberto Gonzales all speak for themselves on this issue.

Quote
So, let me get this right.  The politicians are willing to take the vote of a minority of the voting age public as a mandate, but if that minority is even smaller, then they will get the message and come around to your way of thinking.  As to third party candidates, the reason they do so poorly is because there are so few people who think as you do. Again, I am certainly not happy with everything Bush has done.  But I also don't consider him the lesser of two evils.  I would say that half of loaf is better than none.


The reason most people think like you do is because they have been conditioned to think that way their whole life. From the start of grade school all the way through to college graduation, people are hammered with socialist doctrine and to obey authority. Once out in the world and making their own way, they are relentlessly bombarded by the mass media who continue this conditioning. I am always hearing from my liberal friends that the news has a conservative bias and from my conservative friends that it has a liberal bias. It is neither of course, it is unconditionally pro government biased.

So, sit back, keep voting repugnant, keep thinking you are above everybody else and let our posterity pay for your mistakes. What a wonderful attitude.

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2006, 05:03:32 AM »
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I love it when some arrogant know it all shows his lack of a thought process.  OOOOOOH, you're an attorney and therefore part of the problem.  What does that even mean?  Also, you claim to not need to read SC decisions, because you have read the Constitution.  As the interpreter of last resort of the Constitution, the SC and its opinions are the final word on what's Constitutional, whether you like it or not.  Are there opinions that I find nonsensical?  Of course, but given time the bad ones are usually reversed.  Even though appointed for life, and supposedly not subject to political pressure, we all know that justices are affected by societal trends and not dispassionate interpretors of the law.


I guess when I make present a case you cannot refute, I become arrogant. However, it is you, typical of an attorney, who is arrogant and unable to form a reasoned argument. I would imagine your "practice" isn't doing too well. If you don't know what that means then you are more clueless than I thought. Here's what Thomas Jefferson had to say about your so-called facts:

To consider the judges as the ultimate arbiters of all constitutional questions [is] a very dangerous doctrine indeed, and one which would place us under the despotism of an oligarchy. Our judges are as honest as other men and not more so. They have with others the same passions for party, for power, and the privilege of their corps. Their maxim is boni judicis est ampliare jurisdictionem [good justice is broad jurisdiction], and their power the more dangerous as they are in office for life and not responsible, as the other functionaries are, to the elective control. The Constitution has erected no such single tribunal, knowing that to whatever hands confided, with the corruptions of time and party, its members would become despots. It has more wisely made all the departments co-equal and co-sovereign within themselves." --Thomas Jefferson to William C. Jarvis, 1820. ME 15:277

It is this and many, many more facts the founders wrote and said about the Constitution prove you are completely wrong. I could bury you in them, but what's the point? Looks like you threw away good money obtaining that law degree. Where you get the wild idea that the bad ones are usually reversed is beyond me. I am sure some of them have been, but most are not. Plus, they keep making more and more bad ones!

Quote
What's ludicrous is your belief that not voting, or voting for a third party candidate, will somehow stop the government from stealing my money at the point of a gun.  The Constitution allows the government to levy taxes, and our elected officials have legislated just that thing.  Do I like this?  No, but it is not robbery.  If enough people would vote out all those a**holes that keep raising taxes, we could solve that problem.  As to my remark about "assault weapons", I can assure that I do know a little about the subject.  However, in your zealous attempt to show off your intellect, you missed the fact that I placed that term in quotes.  Of course I could have said "semi-automatic weapons arbitrarily identified as assault weapons based solely upon their appearance", but I assumed that you would understand my clear meaning.  I guess not.  In any event, by voting for Bush, I did and do receive a little more of my money back at tax time (which I can assure you would not be the case if Kerry were president), and I can purchase a semi-automatic weapon arbitrarily identified as an assault weapon based solely on appearance.

The Constitution does not give Congress the right to levy an income tax, sorry. If that were true, why did they feel the need for the 16th Amendment? At least in those days they at least pretended to follow the Constitution. Again sorry, but taxing me to pay for your pet cause is ARMED ROBBERY, whether you want to admit it or not. Then you reverse yourself in the next sentence and appear to agree with me! Do you really believe that things would be very much different if Kerry had won? Now that's funny! In the 2000 election, Bush II ran on a platform of a smaller and less intrusive government, then grew government more than any President in history! As to the intrusive part, I think the Patriot Act, John Ashcroft and Alberto Gonzales all speak for themselves on this issue.

Quote
So, let me get this right.  The politicians are willing to take the vote of a minority of the voting age public as a mandate, but if that minority is even smaller, then they will get the message and come around to your way of thinking.  As to third party candidates, the reason they do so poorly is because there are so few people who think as you do. Again, I am certainly not happy with everything Bush has done.  But I also don't consider him the lesser of two evils.  I would say that half of loaf is better than none.


The reason most people think like you do is because they have been conditioned to think that way their whole life. From the start of grade school all the way through to college graduation, people are hammered with socialist doctrine and to obey authority. Once out in the world and making their own way, they are relentlessly bombarded by the mass media who continue this conditioning. I am always hearing from my liberal friends that the news has a conservative bias and from my conservative friends that it has a liberal bias. It is neither of course, it is unconditionally pro government biased.

So, sit back, keep voting repugnant, keep thinking you are above everybody else and let our posterity pay for your mistakes. What a wonderful attitude.

Offline Casull

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« Reply #49 on: June 22, 2006, 07:16:50 AM »
Quote
guess when I make present a case you cannot refute, I become arrogant. However, it is you, typical of an attorney, who is arrogant and unable to form a reasoned argument. I would imagine your "practice" isn't doing too well. If you don't know what that means then you are more clueless than I thought. Here's what Thomas Jefferson had to say about your so-called facts


BM, thank you for your concern, but my practice is doing just fine.  Aside from your trite railings against attorneys, I find no argument of yours that I haven't buried.  As to Jefferson's concerns about the judiciary, he must have lost that argument, as the Constitution provides as follows:

In all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, and those in which a State shall be Party, the supreme Court shall have original Jurisdiction. In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact

And, inasmuch as the Constitution provides that:

The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority; to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls; to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction; to Controversies to which the United States shall be a Party; to Controversies between two or more States; between a State and Citizens of another State; between Citizens of different States; between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects

it would seem that both you and Jefferson run into a problem with the very language of the Constitution.

[/quote]The Constitution does not give Congress the right to levy an income tax, sorry. If that were true, why did they feel the need for the 16th Amendment?
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Sorry, but my defective legal education would make me think that the Sixteenth Amendment is part of the Constitution.  I guess I'm just not quite as smart as you.

The reason most people think like you do is because they have been conditioned to think that way their whole life.
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So, sit back, keep voting repugnant, keep thinking you are above everybody else and let our posterity pay for your mistakes.
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Seems to me that you are the one thinking he is above everybody else.  In any event, I am now finding you somewhat tiresome, and don't plan to respond to any more of your rantings.  But have a nice day anyway.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline Casull

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« Reply #50 on: June 22, 2006, 07:19:40 AM »
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guess when I make present a case you cannot refute, I become arrogant. However, it is you, typical of an attorney, who is arrogant and unable to form a reasoned argument. I would imagine your "practice" isn't doing too well. If you don't know what that means then you are more clueless than I thought. Here's what Thomas Jefferson had to say about your so-called facts


BM, thank you for your concern, but my practice is doing just fine.  Aside from your trite railings against attorneys, I find no argument of yours that I haven't buried.  As to Jefferson's concerns about the judiciary, he must have lost that argument, as the Constitution provides as follows:

In all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, and those in which a State shall be Party, the supreme Court shall have original Jurisdiction. In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact

And, inasmuch as the Constitution provides that:

The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority; to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls; to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction; to Controversies to which the United States shall be a Party; to Controversies between two or more States; between a State and Citizens of another State; between Citizens of different States; between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects

it would seem that both you and Jefferson run into a problem with the very language of the Constitution.

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The Constitution does not give Congress the right to levy an income tax, sorry. If that were true, why did they feel the need for the 16th Amendment?
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Sorry, but my defective legal education would make me think that the Sixteenth Amendment is part of the Constitution.  I guess I'm just not quite as smart as you.

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The reason most people think like you do is because they have been conditioned to think that way their whole life.
Quote

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So, sit back, keep voting repugnant, keep thinking you are above everybody else and let our posterity pay for your mistakes.
Quote


Seems to me that you are the one thinking he is above everybody else.  In any event, I am now finding you somewhat tiresome, and don't plan to respond to any more of your rantings.  But have a nice day anyway.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #51 on: June 22, 2006, 07:35:45 AM »
Typical take my ball and go home attitude of the defeated. I expect no less from a arrogant attorney who doesn't have a very firm grasp of the founding of the country he lives in. Thomes Jefferson and James Madison don't know what they are talking about, sure. Only you with your superior, holier than thou attitude, supposedly armed with a law degree know everything there is to know about everything and anyone who might have a different opinion or question some of the actions of the government is automatically dismissed as arrogant, stupid and not worth talking to. You have shown yourself to be bigoted and completely closed minded.  Thank-you for exposing yourself as a fool.

Offline nabob

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« Reply #52 on: June 22, 2006, 08:06:07 AM »
Fellas, it's just the Internet. Try not to take it all so personally that we leave here carrying anger with us back into our lives. If a discussion is making you angry, it is time to fuhgeddaboutit.

Wylie - if you are having trouble find the G spot, I'm not sure I can help...  :)

Offline Casull

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« Reply #53 on: June 22, 2006, 08:54:13 AM »
OK BM, I'm going to backtrack on my last post, and respond one more time.  As usual, you do not respond to my arguments, nor to the very words of the Constitution which you claim to hold in such high esteem.  Rather, you call names, expose your ignorance and generally act like a jackass.  So go ahead, call me some more names, and dump on a profession which you obviously know nothing about.  Oh, and keep beating the drum.  If you keep telling everyone that you have all the answers, and that those who disagree with you are bigots and idiots, maybe someone will believe you.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline Bush Master

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« Reply #54 on: June 24, 2006, 06:31:26 AM »
Since you are unable to have a reasonable discourse and started with the name calling in your first post, I was only responding in kind. I can see that you can dish it out but you sure can't take it, no surprise there. I don't believe you have a law degree in the first place. Claiming to have some kind of mastery of the subject being discussed in order to feel superior to those who do not hold your myopic beliefs is very typical of people on the Internet. For all you know, I have a PhD in Constitutional law and only hang out with lawyers. I never said anything about my education, so why is it so important to you for everyone to think you are a lawyer?

I really don't care what you do for a living, who you vote for or anything about you. I see that you think you are superior to everyone and that tells me everything I need to know about you. Go ahead, take your ball and go home.