Author Topic: Shot Placement (Read 1517 times)

Lawdog · « **on:** April 02, 2003, 09:50:45 AM »

Where do you try to place your bullets on game and why?

Me, I believe that except for dangerous game the heart/lung shot is the best way to go. Less meat loss, large target area and still a quick kill. Head and neck shots offer to small a target and to large a margin for error. Texas heart shots should never be taken except to stop a wounded dangerous game animal. Lawdog

shb · « **Reply #1 on:** April 02, 2003, 01:05:33 PM »

over on the hog forum I have been promoting the head shot, mostly for reasons that have to do with my love of smoked ribs, but hogs are pretty easy to position for a head shot. Deer, and Elk, and antelope have to be shot where you find them. It is very difficult to beat the old behind the shoulder shot. It works every time. Also, if you have to stop an escaping animal, the TX Heart shot gets the job done. But you should be a pretty confident marksman before you try it.

Does any one know where the term TX heart shot came from?

Larry Gibson · « **Reply #2 on:** April 02, 2003, 01:45:30 PM »

Lawdog

I'll take a head or neck shot only if I'm absolutely sure of it. Otherwise I go for the the heart/lung shot also. EXCEPT many think that includes the "behind the shoulder" shot, it does not. Have had too many deer/elk travel too far with that shot. While always fatal I have come close to losing a couple and have heard of many others who have lost animals with that shot. Years ago several "old timers" told me of a surer shot that puts deer/elk down in short order regardless of the cartridge given, of course, proper bullets and penetration.

The heart along with the main arteries comming out of it and the thickest most dense part of the lungs lies between the forelegs in the bottom half of the chest cavity up against the brisket. Envision a soccor ball low next to the brisket between the front legs and put your bullet into that soccor ball regardless of the angle and the animal will go down in short order. Yup. you might damage a little more meat that way but bullets of decent construction and reasonable velocity will minimize it. Better that than a lost animal. A bullet into that soccor ball will take out the heart and with the damage to the lungs the animal will die very quickly. Have not have one travel more than 30 yards in all the years I've used that shot when I placed the bullet correctly into the soccor ball. With an entrance and/or exit low with all that damage there is always a massive blood trail. However most deer/elk will go down right away.

As you suggest, dangerous game is another story.

Larry Gibson

WyoHunter · « **Reply #3 on:** May 27, 2003, 12:48:42 PM »

The heart/lung area provides the largest target area on a game animal. Neck/head shots can lead to problems if you aren't careful. Ever see a deer with a broken jaw or shot off nose? You don't lose hardly any meat with a well-constructed bullet and recovery shouldn't be a problem with the heart/lung shot. Craig Boddington has a good book out on shot placement. Jack O'Connor was a big supporter of the heart/lung shot. If you hit a little high you'll hit the shoulder or the spine which will usually drop the animal. :wink:

Power · « **Reply #4 on:** May 27, 2003, 01:22:45 PM »

I'd read so much about a double-lung shot I tried it at last year's deer;

http://www.powerandfury.net/j02deer.html

I was NOT impressed with performance. I have graphic pictures on the second page of that deer. Link at bottom of page.

From now on it's heart shots only for me unless I have no other option than to shoot for another kill zone or wait.

Lawdog · « **Reply #5 on:** May 27, 2003, 03:07:47 PM »

Power,

That's the end result of a high lung shot. Happens. I'll bet the body cavity was just full of blood. Also happens that sometimes a buck is TOUGH and won't go down. I will say this if you had hit him in the shoulder you most likely would have lost up to a quarter of the venison. Nice buck though. I to have a small glade I manage to take a buck a year from. Last year it was my youngest daughters turn and she harvested a buster of a 3x4 there. Lawdog

Power · « **Reply #6 on:** May 27, 2003, 04:59:29 PM »

Thanks Lawdog. Ya, he was a tough young Muley. I knew the first shot was fatal but he started running after the shot so I popped 3 more at him to stop him (missed all 3). Finally he nosed into the dirt after a 100 yard dash. I took my eye off him to reload, went to the spot he'd fallen, and he wasn't there. Thanks to the good tracking effort of myself and my wife we found him about 30 yards further.

Pretty tough deer for taking a double lung shot from a 7mm Rem. at 3,000 fps at a range of about 50 yards.

longwinters · « **Reply #7 on:** May 28, 2003, 11:45:17 AM »

I too would always take the heart lung shot. Although if at all possible I would go thru the shoulder to get there. Now I havent hunted elk and other big animals but for whitetail they rarely take a step. I think that there is so little meat on the front shoulder of a whitetail that what I lose is very little. I also butcher within a day of the kill so that helps in saving meat from getting too bloodshot.

Hud · « **Reply #8 on:** June 07, 2003, 08:46:48 AM »

I only take the heart -lung shot. I'll pass on any other shot anymore. I have had bullets fail me on two different occasions on the heart-lung shot but never the shot itself. On the two bullet failures I still recovered the deer, it is just that the bullets did not expand, caused little damage and one of the deer went farther than normal.

I now, for many years have used 165 gr Sierra Game King boattails in my 30-06 and they have never failed me. I load a Nosler partition in my wifes 6mm Rem.
Hud

Hud · « **Reply #9 on:** June 07, 2003, 08:56:12 AM »

Lawdog,

I think the "Texas Heart Shot" comes from Texas being at the south end of things, is big, and in the middle. Kinda like the entry point of which we speak. And maybe because of some of the bean field rifles they use down their have more than enough "umpa" to make it from the back to the front of a deer.

Hud

High Brass · « **Reply #10 on:** July 08, 2003, 02:49:55 AM »

I shot a 4pt(eastern count) whitetail a few years ago with similar results as Power. About an 80 yard shot high through the lungs with a 165 gr. Core-Lokt out of a 30-06. Buck went about 150 yards before dying(was dead when I found him). Plenty of tracking blood so it was an easy find. I shot a bigger buck the following year that was chasing a doe with the same gun/load combo at almost 150 yards through the heart, buck went down within sight. With "tougher" bullets at modest velocities and ranges, that's typically the norm. Now I load ballistic tips in my '06 at modest velocities and will see what happens. Trial and error.

Power · « **Reply #11 on:** July 08, 2003, 05:35:34 AM »

I should note the bullet I used on my buck last year was a Swift Scirocco, not the ideal bullet for deer-sized game. Might be a good one for bigger, tougher game but for deer it is not a good bullet in my opinion. I'm going back to Partitions since I hunt deer and elk and I think the partition is a good all-around bullet (rapid expansion in the front for energy transfer and a rear section that will penetrate).

I would like to see Nosler make a Partition with a balistic tip. Just wish I had their email address. Seems that would be a really good contruction.

Lawdog · « **Reply #12 on:** July 09, 2003, 10:34:07 AM »

Power,

I'm with you when it comes to Partitions. Been using them for over 40 years without a failure. It's just that those Barnes X and XLC's keep calling to me saying "try me again". So I buy another box and start working on loads again. They just look so good. Maybe someday I'll learn to just say Partitions please. Lawdog

Power · « **Reply #13 on:** July 09, 2003, 04:10:13 PM »

LOL! Ya, I hear you Lawdog. I've only been using premium bullets for about 5 years but I read a lot of hunting mags and internet stuff and I just can't really see a better "all-around" bullet. Sure, other's will penetrate more and hold "90% weight retention" but unless I'm shooting an Elephant I want to make sure most of the energy is transferred into the animal, not into the tree trunk behind it.

Although I have to say the new Nosler Accubond looks interesting. The picture implies they are thin-walled in the front half so maybe they will perform like a standard bullet and open quick to transfer energy with the rear having a thicker wall for sturdiness. Core is bonded so that might work ok. Don't want too much penetration, just enough to depart most of the energy into the animal and maybe just enough to drop the bullet out a big hole on the far side.

AKA Craig · « **Reply #14 on:** July 09, 2003, 04:26:59 PM »

why not remington core lokt. or winchester power point's ? they seem to work great for deer down here i use a .270 to hunt everything unless i happen to have a shotgun with slugs. the core lokts. are very accurate in my gun.

About being "ovregunned" naaa never too much gun i know this guy that hunts whitetails with his 375 but you cant have too much gun

Craig

Lawdog · « **Reply #15 on:** July 10, 2003, 12:09:02 PM »

AKA Craig,

Quote

why not remington core lokt. or winchester power point's ?

The main reason for not using them is I have had them fail in higher velocity rifles like the "magnums". Either they didn't open or they went to pieces, mostly went to pieces. Same reason for not using bullets like the Hornady SST or Nosler Ballistic Tip and others of similar design. Lawdog