GM 58 cal Barrel

[kb]

Anyone get one, and how dows it shoot?  Im thinking of getting one for my T/C or GPR...

Thanks,

Kb

[roundball]

A couple years ago I had GM make one for me in Flint and I put it on a TC Hawken...incredibly accurate...taken 4 bucks with it, complete passthroughs but they were only about 50yds.

100grns Goex 2F
Oxyoke wonderwad
.018" TC prelubed pillow ticking
Hornady .570 ball

[lostid]

A couple years ago I had GM make one for me.

no roundball you didn't have GM make one for you. You bought one like everyone else,,and you was scared to use it,,,now you can say that GM is a good barrel,,and that you do like the GM barrels and that they do shoot good,,even better than T/C if you like.  yet please, Iv'e known you for more than a "couple years ago"
 Please,,tell all of the story,,,Bill/nc  come on man, be honest.

[roundball]

You've been told before to put the cork back in the bottle much earlier in the day...the longer you leave it out the more it affects your brain and it's obvious to anyone reading your personal attact posts.

Year before last I paid GM to take one of their .58cal caplock barrels off the production line, replace the cap breech with a flint breech...then I took two bucks with it that fall, and took two more bucks with it last fall...this is the nicest of the two 10 pointers I got with it last November:



You really need to get a life...you're behavior is a laughing stock of the forum

[quickdtoo]

Lostid,

You're getting mighty close to that line I drew in the sand for ya at the beginning of last month, it's your choice, if you want to stick around, be nice or go play somewhere else!

Tim

[Idaho Ron]

I don't know about the 58 but my renegade has a  SS 50 cal LRH from GM. It  is the best shooting muzzleloader I have ever seen. The only thing I didn't like about it were the sights, and the fact every time I shot it all the screws would back out. I used lock tight and that was done. I got a set of lyman sights andd that was taken care of.  Ron

[Biff Mayhem]

Anyone get one, and how dows it shoot?  Im thinking of getting one for my T/C or GPR...

Thanks,

Kb

You will be so happy with it - that you may want to buy (2)    -- after being worried-silly that it may eventually get discontinued. They are that nice - that accurate! 

[simonkenton]

Can you get that .58 GM barrel for the .50 TC Hawken? I have one that is in dire need of a new barrel.

[roundball]

I think they're only offered in the 1" barrels, but I could be wrong...you might check Green Mountain's website

[lostid]

OK! I take it back
GM are a fine addition or up-grade to the common T/C or Lyman Deer Stalker,Lyman made/Cabelas Hawkin. The I.B.S they offer have a deeper land/groove configuration than the stock barrels and are available in a proper slow-twist for ball or fast-twist for conicals, either of which is an advantage for easy accuracy over the "middlin" 1-48 twist.
 The hook breech of the I.B.S. will fit the GPR stock tang and lock, however the barrel lugs are out of line for the dual wedge of the GPR and the rail is too long. These issuses can easliy be resolved buy an advanced novice or professinol gunsmith. Lyman does offer replacement barrels for the GPR in 50. and 54. cal fast and slow twist.

[simonkenton]

Yeah, I was thinking they were only for the one inch barrels.
I like the idea of a .58 round ball. I used to shoot 'em out of a Zouave. Pretty accurate, too.

[kb]

OOOOOH, SWEET - NICE DEER!!!

Thank you for all the responces.  That TC Flint looks nice.  I shoot a tc 40, 50, and a Lyman GPR 54.  Now Im seriously thinking about it.

kb

[roundball]

Is that TC .40 a Cleland Match Rifle?

I had GM agree to make me a 15/16" .40cal FLINT barrel for a spare Hawken stock...been waiting 3-4 weeks...box was on the porch when I got home today...opened the box and slid out a brand new CAPLOCK barrel !!!!!!
Somebody  at GM got their hands crossed...already Emails waiting in their system for them when they come in tomorrow morning.
But the caplock looks sweet...if they wewren't so expensive, I'd keep it while waiting for the Flint version to arrive but no can do.

[RemingtonMagnum]

NIce buck and better looking rifle. GM makes a 32 cal replacement squirrel barrel for the T/C Renegade I want to get someday. Thanks for the info that is what I wanted to know.

Thanks Don Jackson Remington Magnum

[KW]

roundball that is a geat looking deer!!!!! Don't by chance have any chrono reads of that .58 ca load? Was looking for fps on the .570 rb and any mini-ball readings, sort of an interest of mine. Thanks.

KW

[RemingtonMagnum]

Since we age getting a lot of .000 calculations will someone please tell me what the App weight is of both the 50 cal and 54 cal  round ball. Just curious.

Don Jackson Remington Magnum/Ultramag

[roundball]

roundball that is a geat looking deer!!!!! Don't by chance have any chrono reads of that .58 ca load? Was looking for fps on the .570 rb and any mini-ball readings, sort of an interest of mine. Thanks.

KW

I just use a mid range powder charge of 100grns Goex 2F as all my shots are 30-50yds or so.

TC's load data chart shows 100grns 2F producing 1428fps MV, 1263ft.lbs. ME in a 28" barrel...BUT that's a for a caplock barrel.

I might lose some in the Flint barrel as the vent opening is larger than a nipple opening...so if we even dared to take a WAG, maybe a 28" Flint barrel would only get 1375-1400fps.

On the other hand, that GM barrel of mine is 32", and that additional 4" of barrel might produce another 75-100fps, so even though it's a flinter, it may be up around 1450-1500fps.

I'm embarrassed to say I bought a new chronograph 2 years ago and it's still in the box...planned to use it this year and chrono my rifles but the year has just gone by...maybe after this coming hunting season...

[roundball]

Since we age getting a lot of .000 calculations will someone please tell me what the App weight is of both the 50 cal and 54 cal  round ball. Just curious.

Don Jackson Remington Magnum/Ultramag

Nominal size Hornady ball weights:

.45cal/.440 = 128grns
.50cal/.490 = 180grns
.54cal/.530 = 230grns
.58cal/.570 = 279grns

[KW]

Thanks for the info roundball. I was looking at the T/C Custom Renegade Flintlock in .58 that Fox Ridge Outfitters makes, do you think it would handle that 100 gr FF with one of the T/C 555 grn. Maxi-Balls? Need to get that chrono going, be cool to see what that numbers would be.

[roundball]

Thanks for the info roundball. I was looking at the T/C Custom Renegade Flintlock in .58 that Fox Ridge Outfitters makes, do you think it would handle that 100 gr FF with one of the T/C 555 grn. Maxi-Balls? Need to get that chrono going, be cool to see what that numbers would be.

Oh of course it would...TC's manual lists 80, 90, 100, 110, and 120 grns 2F for either the round ball or the conical.
100grns with the big conical is listed at 1221 fps out of that 28" barrel...with 120grns it's only 1331...but they have a huge muzzle energy...it's what I would use if I was going after something like Grizzly at close range...anything else on the NA continent I'd just use the .58cal round ball.

PS:
The recoil of those big conicals will knock the snot out of you as the saying goes...and are extremely expensive...unless you're independently wealthy, going the conical route will not be something that you'll probably feel like shooting at the range year round

[Swamp Yankee]

I hate the Green Mountian 58 cal!!! Ever since my shooting buddy got one he's been kicking my ass something fierce!!!  Jim

[roundball]

Mine is incredibly accurate...if shot range session with is using 80, then 90, then 100grns and it just doesn't seem to matter what I pour down the spout...just kind of get it pointed in the direction of the target and it finds it's way into the bullseye like a guided missle...don't know if its the caliber, the deep grooved GM barrel, or both, but good gracious it's accurate

[kb]

Yes it is the Cleland.  Nice gun!  Fun, and cheap to shoot.  It is a little heavy to drag around the woods for small game, so that doesnt happen much.  But it does shoot nice. 

Is the twist on the GM 58 cal 1 in 70 inches, or is it slower?

Id like to turn my percussion into a flint, are the locks interchangable?

kb

[roundball]

Yes it is the Cleland.  Nice gun!  Fun, and cheap to shoot.  It is a little heavy to drag around the woods for small game, so that doesnt happen much.  But it does shoot nice. 

Is the twist on the GM 58 cal 1 in 70 inches, or is it slower?

Id like to turn my percussion into a flint, are the locks interchangable?

kb

My .40cal GM Flint barrel will be a little lighter as it's a 15/16", not a 1" barrel;

Yes, the GM .58cal is a 1:70" RB barrel;

Percussion Hawkens (and Renegades) can be converted to Flint...have converted several myself, and it's done one of two ways:
Either the Flint lock assembly will "drop in" or you'll have to tinker and gently shave a ting corner or area of wood out of the way inside the lock mortise...30-60 minutes.

It seem like in the early years, TC had one specific inletting operation for the lock mortise for a caplock stock, and a separate, slightly different inletting operation for the lock mortise on a Flintlock stock.

Then it seems they developed a single generic inletting operation that would allow either lock to drop in...if you have an early stock, you'll need to tinker a bit...if you have a newer stock, the Flint lock assembly should drop right in...and in fact last week I just received an above average beatiful Hawlken caplock stock I bought on EBay, pulled of the caplock asm, and dropped in a Flint lock asm...just shot it at the range this morning.

[KW]

Thanks for the numbers again roundball, looks like I found my new muzzleloader. Which is good because my ol' cva one is about ready to retire. You were dead on about those conicals, I was only looking at them for the big pooh bears and the RB for everything else. Well I guess all that is required now is to get the overtime and pull out the credit card. Do get get groups like the one that Idaho Ron got with is .50 Renegade?

[KW]

roundball, I have another queston to ask ya if you don't mind. Was curious how much extra of a cost it was for you to have GM turn that barrel into a flintlock barrel instead of the standard caplock barrel?

[roundball]

$60 extra...they don't have them made up as a regular production offering, so they have to take a .58cal caplock, debreech it, install a flint breech plug, then reblue the barrel again

[KW]

So roundball, can one expect good accuracy with the 1-48 twist of the T/C barrel? I know it's a sort of medium twist for roundball and conicals, but is it really that bad? Would expecting a 3" group at 75 yds with either conicals or PRB be expecting to much? I know you can't give a definitive answer because every rifle shoots differently, just looking for your experience. Thanks for letting me pick your brain. I hope I am not bothering you to much.

[roundball]

I can't speak to the conicals as I don't use them, but I easily get 2-3" groups at 100yds with my .45/.50/.54cal x 1"48's...would totally expect the same thing from TC's .58cal x 1:48" barrel