Results of my Primer Test today....

[Bullseye]

For a little background let me say that I shoot an Encore 50 Cal. with open sights and 80 grains of loose 777 FFg.  The crud ring with my gun and Winchester 209's has always been pretty light, the crud ring was there but I could load 5 shots without swabbing the bore and a second shot while hunting was never a problem.  You could however feel the crud ring.  I tried CCI primers a couple of years ago and while the crud ring went away so did my accuracy to the tune of 1" groups to 4" groups.

I started by shooting 3 shots with the standard Winchester 209's.  As always the crud ring was there after the first shot, but it was not bad enough to hinder loading of the other two bullets.  POI and accuracy was just like always since I have been shooting these primers for a few years.

Started shooting the Winchester 777 primer after running one wet and one dry patch thru the bore and firing a primer.  I shot 10 rounds using the WInchester 777 primer and never cleaned the bore.  There was never any crud ring that I could detect.  The accuracy stayed good through all 10 rounds.  The POI and the accuracy was the same between the two primers.  After the ten rounds I ran a wet patch down the bore.  I could not detect a crud ring and the fouling down by the breech seemed a lot softer than with the standard Winchester Primers.

I then switched back to the standard Winchester 209's for 3 shots and there was a small crud ring after the first shot.

Well there is my un-scientific test.  I will probably stick with the Winchester 777 primers since the accuracy is the same (remember I am using open sights, shooters with scopes might be able to see a small accuracy difference).  Even though the crud ring never caused me much grief, I might as well eliminate it as long as the accuracy is the same.

I also have some Remmington ML primers laying around somewhere.  I thought I had them with me and was going to try them also, but not only were they not with me, but I cannout find them period.

[S.B.]

Just how are you telling when there is a crud ring in the bore? Visually or by feel with a bullet, while seating?

[alleyyooper]

I saw the winchester triple 7 primers at wally world last night. Wally world prices are normally cheaper than a gun shop. I can buy 300 normal shot gun primers at a gun shop for the price on 100 triple 7 primers at wally world. The Remingtons at wally world were cheaper by a little bit.
It's my 2 cents and I'm keeping it in my pocket as long as the normal primers still work.

  Al

[Biff Mayhem]

I saw the winchester triple 7 primers at wally world last night. Wally world prices are normally cheaper than a gun shop. I can buy 300 normal shot gun primers at a gun shop for the price on 100 triple 7 primers at wally world. The Remingtons at wally world were cheaper by a little bit.
It's my 2 cents and I'm keeping it in my pocket as long as the normal primers still work.

Wally Wold's ML prices on HAZMAT items like powder and primers/caps are high. They expect only the purchasers of such items to pay for the HAZMAT fees and powder storage insurances. For many years, those extras were "passed-along" to the consumer on other ML items, but not anymore.

Slowly-but-surely, all Wally Worlds will eventually discontinue ML components/accessories -- eventually discontinue centerfires, rimfires, shotguns... etc components/accessories. Some stores have already begun this practice.

[Bullseye]

SB

I am checking for a crud ring when loading the shots after the first.  With the standard primers, it is there and the bullet will stop just a little short and some extra effort is require to seat the bullet the last 1/6 - 1/8".  Also when running a wet patch down the barrel, you can feel the crud ring and it takes an extra couple of passes in that area to get rid of it.  These two signs of the crud ring were not there with the 777 primers.

Before doing some other things a few years ago to minimize the crud ring, I have seen it bad enough in my gun that I actualy stuck a patch in the crud ring and had to remove the breech plug to push the rod through beacuse it would not back out.

alleyyopper

You are right, the 777 primers are a little pricey, I bought mine at Gander Mnt and do not remember what I paid.  However, if you buy the standard primers in the blister pack they are also over priced compared to what I used to pay for a 1000 at a time when I reloaded shotgun shells.  I only use about 100 primers a year for my muzzleloader and do not reload shotgun shells anymore, so I am not going to lose any sleep over the extra couple of bucks a year.

[slayer]

Good news :)I use to use the Winchester 209`s and the bore was really dirty and harder to load, but then switched to the Vari-Flame system using Small Pistol Primers and all was good. If the Triple 777 primers work as well as the SPP`s, then I will just use the 777 primers as the Variflame System is kind of a PIA Jack.

[dmurphy317]

I've been doing some primer experiments lately also. My gun came with a breach plug that has a fair amount of blowback. I have not had any issues with a 777 crud ring while using that BP. Recently I got a different BP from the manufacturer that is design for less blowback for testing. The new BP does cause a crud ring similar to the one you describe, crud ring that after the second shot was tough to load the third shot. That was using Kleanbore primers, did not try it with standard Win primers. My conclusion is that the more closed, i.e. less blowback, the BP is, the more crud ring problems you are likely to have. I need to get some of the 777 primers to see if my results are like yours with them.